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 review The Night of Miguelito’s Revenge.
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couldron
SS novice field agent

1438 Posts

Posted - 01/28/2007 :  11:44:31  Show Profile

quote:
This is the way the world ends not with a bang but a whimper.
T. S. Elliot



Unfortunately, this is true of Dr. Loveless last episode. It isn’t as though there are not some charming times. The joke is cute and that mechanical man is menacing but overall it lacks the ingredients of the Dr. Loveless who we came to expect a lot more of than this. Over the series run they whittled the good Dr. down. We no longer have Antoinette and the beautiful duets nor do me have the giant Voltaire. It doesn’t help that we do not have Artie either. Jeremy Pike enters and I believe did a nice job. I do remember my horror at his appearance. Remember I am older than dirt and so I saw the series when it first aired. I didn’t know why Artie was gone. Jeremy did grow on me and I enjoyed the other episodes he did. By this time in the series they were using parts from other episodes so we have the coffin in the water again from Vipers. So goodbye Doctor.

One smiley

Mary

Ecstasy La Joie
SS novice field agent

USA
1799 Posts

Posted - 01/28/2007 :  14:00:45  Show Profile
This is not my favorite Loveless episode, either. It seems like a bit too much effort to compile all the various victims and their crimes just to fit into that poem "Monday's Child," if that's what it's called. Jim does fit the description of the child born on the Sabbath Day, though(brave and bonny). It also lacks because we are missing our Artie. Though Jim was probably the bigger thorn for Loveless, it was Jim and Artie who ended up battling Loveless together. It seems the powers that be conjured up a host of others, perhaps in an attempt to distract us from the missing Artemus - as if that could work. Jeremy Pike did alright, but those were huge shoes to fill, even for a couple of episodes (TNOT Janus). I, too, saw the series when it first aired, (I don't know if I'm older than dirt, but as of today, I'm one year closer) and I was confused and upset that Artie was gone. I felt like I was being cheated. I'll give 1 smiley for Jim and 1 frowny for our missing Artie.
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couldron
SS novice field agent

1438 Posts

Posted - 01/28/2007 :  15:39:53  Show Profile
quote:

(I don't know if I'm older than dirt, but as of today, I'm one year closer)

Should I say Happy Birthday then?

Happy Birthday

Mary
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Pidgeon
SS novice field agent

2666 Posts

Posted - 01/28/2007 :  18:33:58  Show Profile
Yes. Happy Birthday, Ecstasy!!

"Any scene can be more freshly and clearly seen when it is seen upside down." G.K. Chesterton
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Cindylover1969
SS novice field agent

United Kingdom
1267 Posts

Posted - 01/29/2007 :  00:13:27  Show Profile  Visit Cindylover1969's Homepage
Truly a poor episode - Loveless deciding to dispose of Jim by burying him alive in a river pretty much says it all; this is the man who set up a double of Jim, who gave him a dose of acid-before-its-time, who zapped him into a painting to shoot it out with a whole load of bandidos, and who tried to give him a lobotomy... and then he just dumps him in a river? (Not to mention setting up an escape sequence that not only falls victim to Season 4's general cheapness but is pretty bad in its own right.)

"Make them both as uncomfortable as possible." - Marquis de la Mer, "The Night of the Watery Death"
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Dieter Epping
SS senior field agent

USA
6498 Posts

Posted - 01/29/2007 :  00:37:44  Show Profile
This is a Loveless episode that I haven't seen in a very long time and that is mostly intentional. I remember that this, without Artie, should never have been made in the first place. And I completely agree with you, couldron, that without Voltaire and later without Antoinette, the Loveless episodes completely fell apart. They were not the original fantastic trio of insane people planning to rule the world anymore. So sad because if those 3 stayed together in every episode I think it would have gone down as the best group of villains in TV history. Though Murderous Spring was one of the best without Voltaire, I wish he was still in it somewhere.

Stars for me for the final Loveless episode.
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Ecstasy La Joie
SS novice field agent

USA
1799 Posts

Posted - 01/29/2007 :  04:42:42  Show Profile
Yes, yesterday was my birthday. Thank you for the good wishes. I celebrated by watching 2 episodes of our favorite show. The first was Grand Emir, of course. Its original air date was my 6th birthday. That, combined with my affection for the episode in itself and my belief that Ms. Craig was The One, made it a "must see". The second was TNOT Legion of Death. I wanted to see a color epi as well and chose this one because of the humorous exchanges between our boys and all the really stellar kissing scenes. All in all a great birthday. My dad and I celebrated together.
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Herr Ostropolyer
SS 1st assignment - desk job

USA
209 Posts

Posted - 01/29/2007 :  15:27:05  Show Profile
Hey All,

Great reviews as always! I must agree that TNO Miguelito's Revenge is the weakest entry in Loveless' outtings. It is full of rehashes and Dr, Loveless is reduced to nothing more than a common gangster. True, we have guest agent Jeremy Pike(Charles Aidman), but even if Artie was in this episode it still would have been a stinker.

I give Charles Aidman a lot of credit in that he played Jeremy Pike as Pike in disguise. He did not go the easy route and try to play over the top characters. I'm not saying that RM's characters were over the top, but RM did not play Artie in Disguise, instead he played a different character every week. Aidman respected this and gave Pike believabilty as a replacement agent who also wore disguises. We as an audience can believe Pike, but the producers stretch credibility when other guest agents like William Schalert's Frank Harper was also a master of disguise. I just wish the producers had Aidman be the guest agent for all the Artieless episodes.

I blame the producers and not Michael Dunn for this interpretation of Dr. Loveless. It was the new creedo of CBS to define what WWW was and it was decided by season 3 that it was a Western, thus the plots were more down to earth and very Western! Dr, Loveless is a character that is straight out of Science fiction thus could he really exist in the new down to earth Wests. The answer is an overwhelming no! Loveless tries to rule the US by taking over military bases with his milita (TNOT Bogus Bandits). In season 3's TNT Dr. Loveless Died, the Good Doctor seeks out revenge on West via a frontal labotomy. Many fans on this board really disliked this episode. I was not one of them because I felt that this was the proper place for the West/Loveless adventures to go with one of them dying, and as that episode suggests Loveless dies in the inferno that destroys his sanitarium.

However, Loveless is back and he is getting revenge on all the people that have wronged him. Yes, that is it my friends, No scheme to shrink all mankind and be a god, No destroying the wicked world around him with mind altering drugs, or destroying all life with a spray, and no hopping in and out of paintings to rule the world. Instead, we get Gangster Loveless and his kidnapping and punishing of the ones that wronged him with revenge. (Ho-Hum.)

If last week's TNO Fire and Brimstone gave me a heavy heart for the loss of Artie, TNO Miguelito's Revenge depresses me because it is the final time we will see the magnificient Michael Dunn cross swords with our hero. But this adventure does end on a whimper and not a bang. Dunn's presence can't even save this rehash ladden muck! Steamed powered thug, (Can anyone say TNOT Puppeteer?) or the watery coffin dip, (TNOT Vipers). RC, Dunn, and Aidman are excellent but their valliant efforts cannot save this mess. The toast with the three drinks (1 for Artie that disappears) is a nice touch for our missing Agent!

2 out of 5 stars. Dunn and the audience deserved better than this !

Herr Ostropolyer

"There will be another time...another time...another time..." -Dr. Loveless in TNO Miguelito's Revenge. Sadly, this threat was never meant to be. Instead, our agents would verse Paul Williams' Miguelito Loveless Jr. in "The Wild Wild West Revisted".

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Cindylover1969
SS novice field agent

United Kingdom
1267 Posts

Posted - 01/29/2007 :  23:20:18  Show Profile  Visit Cindylover1969's Homepage
quote:
Originally posted by Herr Ostropolyer
Dunn's presence can't even save this rehash ladden muck! Steamed powered thug, (Can anyone say TNOT Puppeteer?) or the watery coffin dip, (TNOT Vipers).


Not to mention the coffin dip uses the EXACT SAME FOOTAGE as the earlier episode (at least there the coffin wasn't the size of a penthouse suite... and don't get me started on the effects).

"Make them both as uncomfortable as possible." - Marquis de la Mer, "The Night of the Watery Death"
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Ecstasy La Joie
SS novice field agent

USA
1799 Posts

Posted - 01/30/2007 :  05:10:34  Show Profile
Refresh my memory, please. Is this the one where we hear the song "What do you do with a drunken sailor?" Imagine the image of a seven to eight year-old girl singing this around the house!
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CharlieTobin
SS spy school graduate

USA
95 Posts

Posted - 01/30/2007 :  06:50:30  Show Profile
Well, I've referenced this episode in various other reviews in the past, and it does have some interesting qualities, but in the end, this one stinks.

As couldron mentioned, it seems like after ten episodes, little Miguelito has been worn down. The absence of diabolical, clever, sci-fi elements of terror are nowhere to be found, and it's painfully obvious that Kneubuhl's original vision and Freiberger's production are as far as the east is from the west. The pattern that began in "TNOT Bogus Bandits" and "TN Dr. Loveless Died", with Loveless resorting to keeping company with thugs (when, previously, he had no problem giving West headaches on his own) continues here, with the unintelligent Pylo and the unimpressive Tiny flanking him.

Not only that, but the good Doctor, who previously "abhorred spirits", is now an imbiber, citing the empty bottle of cognac as a travesty. Maybe it was the constant defeat by West that drove him to drink, but whatever the reason, Loveless has gone against his own values, and Kneubuhl must have been scratching his head, thinking "What have they done with my creation?"

It's interesting to note how many pieces of this story were "borrowed" from other eps. I'll add one more: the "disappearing" newsstand during the teaser is a sort of lift from "TNOT Turncoat", in a plot device meant to confuse our agent, and us.

The fourth act reminded me a bit of the third-season episodes of "Batman", where, instead of actual sets, cartoonish props would be set up on the same glittery-floored stage (a hanging "window", or a series of "walls", all against a black background) in an effort to save money. By this point in the episode and the series, it just seemed like money, time and patience had all run out, and....yeah.

(In fact--not to deviate totally--the penultimate "Batman" episode, "The Entrancing Dr. Cassandra", featured a fight scene near the end which was shot totally in the dark. The bad guys were invisible, so Batman shot out the lights to level the playing field, but it also saved the producers even more money, since the whole thing took about ten minutes to set up and shoot.)

Definitely not a favorite, but here's one smiley face for one of ten Loveless episodes, and just because it's in the WWW canon.

"Eyes aren't enough these days!"
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orrin cobb
SS novice field agent

USA
959 Posts

Posted - 01/31/2007 :  08:08:39  Show Profile  Visit orrin cobb's Homepage
I have to say that the only good thing about this episode was Charles Aidman. I had previously been introduced to this actor through his performance in his New York stage adaption of Edger Lee Masters' "Spoon River Anthology" which I had the cast recording of. Here he played a variety of characters, all of which were distinct in the vocal recording. From what I can gather from Sue's book on the series, Mr. Aidman seemed stuck in a difficult position subbing for our beloved Ross Martin. Maybe it was because of the uncertainty of Ross's condition and future, and whether the producers had at a point thought of grooming him as a replacement if Ross was unable to return. But I thought Aidman, a more than capable character actor, brought his own touch of class to what had always been a classy show; although by this point in the series run the scripts were proving weak. I enjoyed his turn as Jeremy Pike- he created his own character and not an attempt to copy Ross's Artemus.

"Let's get this train on the road!"-Artemus Gordon
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MaudeB
SS novice field agent

582 Posts

Posted - 01/31/2007 :  14:15:25  Show Profile

No Artie, no Antoinette, no Voltaire and no duets???

What genius thought that one up?

Maybe Jim and Jeremy should have headed off to Washington to attend a secret agent seminar to break up the monotony!?!

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ccb
SS Quizmaster Emeritus

3799 Posts

Posted - 01/31/2007 :  23:02:15  Show Profile
After this episode there was never "another time" for Agent West to meet his nemesis Dr. Loveless, in spite of the latter's recorded assurance at the end of Act IV. Our reviews of this episode are inevitably tinged by this sad circumstance.

I'm on record as expressing disappointment with all the Loveless episodes after his creator, John Kneubuhl, left the series in late 1966. Kneubuhl himself is on record with his own disappointment at what later writers did with his most famous character. By the time we got to "The Night Dr. Loveless Died" (1967), I wondered aloud whether it or "Miguelitio's Revenge" would get my vote as the least of the Loveless encounters.

I think I gave the penultimate installment . The final I'll give . Why?

1. Though nowhere near the top of the Loveless saga, "Miguelito's Revenge" at least gave us a credible, in–character story–premise. Henry Sharp's notion (Season 3) that Loveless would need to fake his death to draw in West as his guardian never rang true for me. The dwarf who could hold his own on a wrestling mat against three bruisers ("The Wizard Shook the Earth") would never have needed West as his protector, any more than West would have believed that his anatgonist could have a look–alike German uncle. (German? Loveless's father was of Spanish extraction.) Jerry Thomas's script in Season Four posits that the little megalomaniac would have accrued enemies he detested over a lifetime of furstrations. To me, that makes more sense.

2. I'll grant that the MacGuffin for the kidnappings—a Mother Goose rhyme—had to be stretched in idiot directions (a jockey?). Still, using a nursery rhyme as an M.O. is a vague reminiscence of Kneubuhl's original conception of his character, who pitched temper-tantrums when "big sister" ate all his chocolates ("The Murderous Spring"). As Anotinette said in introducing him ("The Wizard"), "Sometimes he is like a child." Children famously wish they could run away and join the circus.

By the way, the real rhyme was rearranged (swapping the characteristics of Friday's and Saturday's children) and reworded to work West into the proceedings. In Mother Goose, "A child that's born on the Sabbath day/Is wise and fair and good and gay."

3. I'll concede that Loveless the heavy drinker is a far cry from the figure who abhored bestial spirits ("Terror Stalked the Town"). But Kneubuhl himself laid the basis for this shift in "The Murderous Spring," when he had Loveless offer the recovering West "some sherry. It will do you good."

4. In still other respects there are vestiges, vague resemblances of the villain we once knew.
  • The scientific genius could build a steam–powered mechanical man, and then would be brazen enough to play the role of doll while ventriloquizing his creation. That, by the way, is an homage to the famous horror tale "The Glass Eye," produced as a memorable segment of Alfred Hitchcock Presents.

  • "Tiny" is a poor man's Voltaire, which at least recalls the original duo: the mute giant and the little man who won't stop talking. Ironically, in the Kesler Bible, Kneubuhl credits Fred Freiberger for giving Voltaire his name, because‚ as Kneubhul too modestly claimed, "I have a dull kind of imagination. I probably would have called him 'Shorty.'"

  • Ecstasy is right: This is the one in which Michael Dunn sings "Drunken Sailor." We hadn't heard his vocalizing since "Green Terror," the last of the Antoinette episodes.

  • Susan Seaforth ("Delilah") amply qualifies Loveless's professed weakness for beautiful women. And Loveless always surrounded himself with them: Greta. Marie. Priscilla. Belladonna. Triste. When Phobe Dorin left the series, an important dimension of Loveless was lost. Apparently, however, that wasn't her or the producers' decision. It was Michael Dunn's.

  • A trivial but nice touch: In Act II, we see Loveless in a stagecoach, wearing the small stovepipe hat that we saw for the first and last time when we first met the little man on 1 October 1965. I'm sentimental. I like that.


I don't disagree with the criticism others have raised. Yes, by now the series was cannibalizing its earlier ideas and even its film footage. (Another that hasn't been mentioned: Tiny, like Torres, takes a bullet in the head and keeps on coming.) Yes, the production values were obviously sagging. Mike Garrison lavished money on his show, and it showed. Bruce Lansbury pacified CBS with a tight bottom line. That too always showed.

Still, for all its many faults, "Miguelito's Revenge" reminds me of a day when the West was doubly Wild: when impeccably dressed dwarfs swirled their brandies, plotted revenge over gothic organs, jerry–built their own juries, and escaped as human cannonballs. In "The Night of the Raven" Loveless dreamed to Antoinette of an altitude so high that he could forever sail among the stars. I like to think that's exactly what he did— and that his outlandish escape at the end of this final meeting was an unintended metaphor for exactly that.

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Cindylover1969
SS novice field agent

United Kingdom
1267 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2007 :  00:06:52  Show Profile  Visit Cindylover1969's Homepage
quote:
Originally posted by ccb
  • Susan Seaforth ("Delilah") amply qualifies Loveless's professed weakness for beautiful women. And Loveless always surrounded himself with them: Greta. Marie. Priscilla. Belladonna. Triste. When Phobe Dorin left the series, an important dimension of Loveless was lost. Apparently, however, that wasn't her or the producers' decision. It was Michael Dunn's.




  • That might explain why "The Night of the Surreal McCoy" doesn't have any female companionship for Loveless (in fact I don't think that has any female characters at all, not even in the tag!).

    "Make them both as uncomfortable as possible." - Marquis de la Mer, "The Night of the Watery Death"
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    Ecstasy La Joie
    SS novice field agent

    USA
    1799 Posts

    Posted - 02/01/2007 :  04:34:46  Show Profile
    That's a major factor in my disappointment. Couldn't they have written in even a slight flirtation with a passing female?! We've all seen Jim West at work. He can definitely save the world and smooch at the same time!!
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    ccb
    SS Quizmaster Emeritus

    3799 Posts

    Posted - 02/01/2007 :  11:24:22  Show Profile
    Cindylover1969: That might explain why "The Night of the Surreal McCoy" doesn't have any female companionship for Loveless (in fact I don't think that has any female characters at all, not even in the tag!).

    That's right. I made that fact the subject of one weekend's quiz: "The Surreal McCoy" is unique in that none of its actors—or credited production staff, for that matter—was female.
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    SordoTheBandit
    SS 1st assignment - desk job

    468 Posts

    Posted - 02/01/2007 :  18:47:50  Show Profile
    Ahhh, the 4th Season....

    Too little Ross....
    Too much Aidman....

    Too little Michael Dunn....
    Too much Senator Pastore....

    Too little Phoebe Doran....
    Too much Pat Paulsen.... (Once is too many)

    Too little Sherry Jackson....
    Too much Gilligan's Island....

    Too little imagination....
    Too much rehash....

    I liked this swan song with Michael Dunn. I liked his song 'Drunkin Sailor', his mechanical man, his organ playing, and even his outfits. I had fun when this episode originally aired in 1968. Unfortunately, in the end, when a voice was heard exclaiming "There will be another time.", little did we know that this would be our last adventure with the infamous Dr Loveless.

    3 STARS
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    MaudeB
    SS novice field agent

    582 Posts

    Posted - 02/02/2007 :  08:50:22  Show Profile

    TOO MUCH PAT PAULSEN!!!

    That is not possible, my friend. He and the Smothers Brothers are the absolute funniest comedians that ever lived!! "Pumas in the cravasses!" Come on!

    Of course, there is also Red Skelton and Bill Cosby.

    Oh, and Ellen Degeneris.

    But only Pat was on www. Maybe they should have used more comedians.
    (I hope that's not sacrilege!)
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    couldron
    SS novice field agent

    1438 Posts

    Posted - 02/02/2007 :  10:41:19  Show Profile
    Wasn't Richard Pryor a comic? We had to little of him.

    Mary
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    SordoTheBandit
    SS 1st assignment - desk job

    468 Posts

    Posted - 02/02/2007 :  11:38:25  Show Profile
    Pat Paulsen is like Will Smith. Both have their talents and their place, but not on the The Wild Wild West. I wouldn't want to see Don Adams in an episode either, but he excelled in Get Smart.
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    MaudeB
    SS novice field agent

    582 Posts

    Posted - 02/02/2007 :  12:15:49  Show Profile
    quote:
    Originally posted by SordoTheBandit

    Pat Paulsen is like Will Smith. Both have their talents and their place, but not on the The Wild Wild West. I wouldn't want to see Don Adams in an episode either, but he excelled in Get Smart.



    Don Adams would have been great in the right part - he could play more than Maxwell Smart. Loved Pat - love Will Smith (although we all know of one bad part he had). I enjoy seeing these guys leaving the security of their usual "types". It can lead to some enjoyable, and surprising, entertainment.
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    ccb
    SS Quizmaster Emeritus

    3799 Posts

    Posted - 02/02/2007 :  15:50:35  Show Profile
    MaudeB: Don Adams would have been great in the right part.

    Maybe someday we should play You Are the Casting Agent: In which character in which episode might Don Adams have excelled? Or you can play the game in reverse: If Mike Garrison hadn't wanted Don Rickles to play Asmodeus, whom would you have recommended?
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    SordoTheBandit
    SS 1st assignment - desk job

    468 Posts

    Posted - 02/02/2007 :  16:10:05  Show Profile
    If Mike Garrison hadn't wanted Don Rickles to play Asmodeus, whom would you have recommended?

    You know, I hadn't thought about that. In fact, I forgot that Rickles was on one of the best episodes of the series and he was good. It's just that "Then Came Paulsen" still sticks in my mind from 1970 from ABC's "Pat Paulsen's Half A Comedy Hour". I just never thought he was a good match for a character on www. To me, Paulsen was like horseradish smeared on a wedding cake instead of frosting.
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    Ecstasy La Joie
    SS novice field agent

    USA
    1799 Posts

    Posted - 02/03/2007 :  05:05:40  Show Profile
    MaudeB, I thought I was probably the only one who remembered the "pumas in the cravasses"!! That is one hilarious schtick! Thanks for the memory!
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    beerbad
    SS novice field agent

    683 Posts

    Posted - 02/03/2007 :  06:47:59  Show Profile
    I watched it last night and it really is a half and half kind of show. So, it gets 2 and one half stars. First, seeing Red (West) and White(y) Hughes never gives me the blues! Pun intended. Yes, it was bad, but it is a pun. I agree with ccb that Loveless is not above simply murdering people even if it's not connected to a world dominating plot. In his "twisted" (thanks, Artie) mind if you wrong him you are worthy of death. I wonder if the actress that Loveless sent to be coached and was rejected was a reference to Antoinette. To him, rejecting his friends is also worthy of death. Loyal but muderous. So, Loveless really was insane, although he denied it in this episode. But, a true madman does not think he is insane. The rest of the world is insane. This could explain why he now drinks. He is unstable in his mind as well as his principles.

    The jury in the dark reminded me of Puppeteer,also. It really is a mishmash. But, it seems all 1960's shows went downhill in their last season. "TV eats up ideas" was a quote I read from Dr. Smith of Lost in Space.

    "I abhor spirits, they make a man less than human" - Dr. Loveless, The Night That Terror Stalked the Town
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    ccb
    SS Quizmaster Emeritus

    3799 Posts

    Posted - 02/03/2007 :  09:08:53  Show Profile
    Good points, b.b.

    E La J: MaudeB, I thought I was probably the only one who remembered the "pumas in the cravasses"!! That is one hilarious schtick! Thanks for the memory!

    Through the miracle of CDs, years ago I introduced my now seventeen-year-old daughter to classic Smothers Brothers, including, "Chocolate" (written by Pat Paulsen), "Hangman," the pet chicken, and those pumas in cravasses. And we've never stopped cackling.
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    Redhead1617
    SS novice field agent

    USA
    1393 Posts

    Posted - 02/03/2007 :  10:17:27  Show Profile  Visit Redhead1617's Homepage
    quote:
    Refresh my memory, please. Is this the one where we hear the song "What do you do with a drunken sailor?" Imagine the image of a seven to eight year-old girl singing this around the house!


    ROTFLMBO!! that was too good Ecstasy!!! Love that song, I just have to be careful not to slip and sing it outloud at work instead of lip-syncing to the shuffle ipod that my best friend loaned me

    Okay, episode. Unlike those of you who saw the original airings, this was not my first Artie-less episode so the shock was given to Winged Terror for me. It was just wrong to pit Loveless against Jim without Artie and hardly mentioning Artie at all to boot! Although Loveless hated Jim, Artie was just as much a thorn in the side and to put Jeremy up against Loveless cold like that, that was wrong... to just end the Loveless episodes without Artie and on that note... just... so... very... very... wrong...

    As for the episode itself, I kind of didn't mind the whole nursery rhyme thing, I must shame-faced admit that is something that I would do and use and I'm not any better than the script writers in this department, it's just a thing with English Majors I suppose...



    The black eye for no RM and the single smiley I'm reserving for another episode or two

    ~Red

    http://rdpieters.etsy.com

    Quality Over Quantity
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    Ecstasy La Joie
    SS novice field agent

    USA
    1799 Posts

    Posted - 02/03/2007 :  11:45:16  Show Profile
    OK Red, I have to ask, what is ROTFLMBO?? This forum has brought me into the world of abbreviations, and so far, I've managed to figure things out, but I need help with this one. No doubt, I will feel foolish for having asked, but thems the breaks! Who sings your copy of the song? I'd love to get my own copy.
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    Redhead1617
    SS novice field agent

    USA
    1393 Posts

    Posted - 02/03/2007 :  12:53:17  Show Profile  Visit Redhead1617's Homepage
    no need to be embarrassed, I'm still learning may abbreviations myself even after these past... nive years or so

    ROTF- Rolling on the floor

    -LMBO- Laughing My Butt Off

    -LOL- Laughing Out Loud

    there are many tags to ROTF

    actually Kevin James sings my version, it's a hoot. I guess he's some folk singer or something but my best friend saw him in a pub in Boston or Baltimore or somewhere. It's on a cd of lots of Irish folk songs, all a riot. Drop my an email at BonnyBarbyAllen@yahoo.com and we'll see what we can do about getting you that cd

    ~Red

    http://rdpieters.etsy.com

    Quality Over Quantity
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