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couldron
SS novice field agent

1438 Posts

Posted - 04/12/2004 :  22:51:27  Show Profile


This is one of the best episodes of Loveless. I had never paid attention to the opening like I did watching this the other night. I never noticed the boys playing sea saw. These are the boys that make fun of Kitten (Jenie Jackson). The whole town makes fun of her size but not James West. He helps her to carry her “luggage” into the hotel room. Although he does not make fun of her, what an expression of concern is on his face when she sits down on the bed. Jenie Jackson also appeared as Kitten in Bars of Hell but there is such a difference in the characters that I don’t think they are suppose to be the same character. In Bars, she was boisterous and sure of herself and I don’t think that character cared what people thought of her. Where this Kitten is the opposite. Her performance I think was a very powerful portrayal.
Other than the mysterious powder, there aren’t any gadgets and Artie is never in disguise.

The boys learn to get Loveless to tell them his plan by acting disinterested and unbelieving. Which leads to Loveless killing most of his loyal followers. Leaving Kitten to clean up a bit of a mess. Loveless has lost all concern for anyone but himself. Where as he once wanted to make a beautiful world for children he now wants to kill them.
RC best acting is in this episode. Do you think it is because of his father being in this episode?
K Mills wrote a wonderful sequel to this story,The Night of the Insane Manhttp://www.wildwildwest.org/w2/fanfic/stories/TNot_Insane_Man.html

The review of the last episode of season one is posted by beerbad

Next time we start reviewing the Second season in glorious color.

n/a
deleted

243 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2004 :  13:50:24  Show Profile
I like this ep so much that when I found this forum I didn't have to think twice before choosing my login name.
M. Spring at your service.
I love the surrealistic, dreamlike quality of this ep and the evilness of Loveless. And the ending. I'd have said this is my favorite episode, but I'm an Artie gal and my favorite of all time is Artie's starring episode. No complaints from me about Murderous Spring, though.
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Redhead1617
SS novice field agent

USA
1393 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2004 :  20:26:06  Show Profile  Visit Redhead1617's Homepage
Of all the Loveless episodes, this one is my favorite. While I still love Terror Stalked the Town and Raven is a hoot, this one is simply amazing and puts me in awe each time I watch it. This episode has some of the best dialogue in it and the friendship between Jim & Artie really shines through in this one. Loveless is certainly at his most ruthless in this one and has less of that child-like nature that we see in other episodes (despite Kitten refering to him as the little one, etc)

a few of my favorite quotes: (a tough choice to pick a few, I have a whole page of quotes on my site http://redhead1617.tripod.com/wildwildwest/ )


West: "Would you mind punching me?"
Gordon: "Well I'd be happy to oblige. Tell me why?"


Loveless: "Now, to make a man kill the thing he loves, that requires genius"


West: "Sorry. For a moment Artie, it was almost like I hated you."
Gordon: "Yeah, sure"


West: "I said get out of my way"
Gordon: "No"
*Pow*
Gordon: "Why?"


Gordon: "Why? Is he hurt?"
Hotel Manager:" No sir, it's worse than that."
Gordon: "What do you mean?"
Hotel Manager: "Well, he went mad"
Gordon: "What?"
Hotel Manager: "He went stark raving mad"


Loveless: "Ultimately we are all prisoners, are we not Mr. West? 'Cause we can never escape ourselves. Stone walls are never so much a prison as the skin that surrounds each of us."


Loveless: "To accuse me of bragging, may as well accuse the sun of being egocentric because it shines"
West: "Mmm hmm"


Loveless: "Not sure why I put up with you"
West: "Because you need me."
Loveless: "I need you? Now who's being egocentric?"


Loveless: "You know what tomorrow is?"
West: "No."
Loveless: "The end of winter. Tomorrow everywhere except in the breast of man the chill will begin to thaw."


Gordon: "Easy on the suspenders friend, that's the only pair I've got."





oh K, that is one awesome sequel if I do say so myself!! (and I do )


~Red

*sigh...where's MY Ross Martin?
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K Mills
SS novice field agent

849 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2004 :  05:54:57  Show Profile
Thanks, Mary and Red. That was the first story I wrote after years of my keyboard being idle and frankly, I cringe when I read it. I had some good ideas but the vehicle for delivery was haphazard at best. This is one of my favorite episodes. RC really hit all the high points and Ross Martin was excellent. One of my favorite ideas behind it was how Artie looked and acted in Jim's delusions. Think about it. Would Artemus wear that ugly plastic coat? I think not. He has far too much style.
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Elaine
SS 1st assignment - desk job

356 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2004 :  19:18:28  Show Profile
You all know that I am not known for my insightful ep reviews, but I do have a few comments.

I'd have to agree with Mary and K that RC does a great acting job in this episode.

Being a sentimentalist, I tend to favor the emotional episodes. Dr. L's quote, "To make a man kill the thing he loves, that requires genius." could be the theme for this ep. Loveless, of course, wants Jim to kill Artie. Loveless himself intends to kill so many people, and as Mary mentioned, especially the children whom he previously wanted to protect. Kitten betrays Loveless, a man she has said she loves, and in not rescuing him from the lake, believes she is killing him.

There is more than enough angst in this ep for me. It is one of the eps that makes it clear how Jim and Artie feel about each other. The usually stoic James West has to deal with emotions that are out of his control. I very much appreciate the fact that Jim treated Kitten with genuine respect. He was nice to her in the scene where he carried her valise (and not in that smarmy, fake nice way he often uses on women). Even when he and Artie are trying to use her dream that Loveless will make her beautiful to get her to free them, they never make fun of her and even appear to feel sorry that they have to use her weakness against her even if it for the best of causes. In a '60's series that often contained sexist remarks by our own heroes (!), it seems unusually sensitive for the times to treat Kitten this way.

Interesting to see 1/2 of the pair that created the incredibly handsome RC.

And one Artie note (ah, among so many), I love the pose he takes on the bed in Jim's room when he and Jim are waiting for Loveless. Yum!

I agree, folks.

P.S. I took the opportunity to reread K's story. That was your first effort? Interesting tidbit of WWW fanfic history. Lots to like there never the less.
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AdorableBlue
SS novice field agent

948 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2004 :  22:27:33  Show Profile  Visit AdorableBlue's Homepage
quote:
I'd have to agree with Mary and K that RC does a great acting job in this episode.
I know many tend to quote this eps when it comes to RC's great acting. Does anyone else also think his acting skills were as good if not, greater in TNOT Death Masks? (though this eps was never kinda associated when the topic arise). Anyway..........Blue certainly love his various facial expressions and "eye-play" in the various eps,too. (Now you know why Blue's glued to the man!)

In Spring Jim displays his emotions towards Artie and also, what he feels about Loveless in all their encounters. They'd make good pals, wouldn't they, Jim and Loveless - though on the opposite side. (Blue trying to learn more about Jim).

Murderous Spring and Loveless with M.Spring springing out Great!




AdorableBlue
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couldron
SS novice field agent

1438 Posts

Posted - 04/15/2004 :  08:23:29  Show Profile
quote:
know many tend to quote this eps when it comes to RC's great acting. Does anyone else also think his acting skills were as good if not, greater in TNOT Death Masks?


Funny you should mention this because I meant to. In Death Mask, the theme of getting Jim to Kill Artie is revisited. However, it does not seem like a retread. Both episodes are good.
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Redhead1617
SS novice field agent

USA
1393 Posts

Posted - 04/16/2004 :  21:02:53  Show Profile  Visit Redhead1617's Homepage
I too forgot to mention RC's excellent acting in both, but especially in this one. As you all know by now, I'm mainly an Artie gal and b&w episodes give me slight a.d.d. when we see little of Artie, but this episode being a big Jim ep held me quite rapt

and I also forgot to mention that our boys interactions with Kitten, especially when Jim first encounters her and everybody else is making fun of her, Jim's attitude towards her really impressed me the first time I saw this episode

A big fan of Death Masks, I must agree RC shows great acting there and also in Pistoleros, after watching it a few times over & over and then just the ending over & over again, I really appreciate 'Jim's' reaction to his presumingly dead partner and friend. It isn't very emotional on the outside but "thanks Artie" says so much, thanks for saving me & thanks for not really being dead

~Red

*sigh...where's MY Ross Martin?
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ccb
SS Quizmaster Emeritus

3799 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2004 :  08:29:25  Show Profile
This lily hardly needs gilding. Again, I'll try to be brief.

IMHO, The series never did better than "The Night of the Murderous Spring." In addition, I consider it the definitive Loveless episode.

* Conrad, Martin, Dunn: None of them ever gave a better performance than they do here. And Jenie Jackson was flawless. You think it's easy to render convincing portrayals of love, madness, pain, and death? Who among us has the talent for it? How many episodes of West even permitted the exploration of such deep feelings? Even the small parts, like Bill McLean's hotel clerk, are done with care.

* That brings us to the script by John Kneubuhl, Loveless's creator. This is the show that took the character over the edge to new and funny, tender and frightening places. Regaining California is no longer the issue; he now wants to destroy all human life—and the reasons for it are made understandable. Return to the speech Kneubuhl wrote in Act III, and watch how movingly Michael Dunn delivers it. The text is about the end of wnter, the birth of spring, small things stunted from full potential by the meanness of man. The subtext, of course, is Loveless's own life as a dwarf. Kneubhul and Jackson do the same with the Kitten character: They help us to understand a kind life maimed by human cruelty. And yet the show is never preachy: It's done with subtlety, surrounded by all the action and entertainment we tune in to watch.

* Richard Donner was one of West's most gifted directors. Notice the camera's low angle, shooting upward, for the scene in whiuch Lovelss addresses West from his throne. They had to build a ceiling for the set to make that work. (Alan Crosland would copy this technique in "The Surreal McCoy.") Recall the staging of the staff's murdering of itself, behind a bolted door that almost gives way, and the different reactions from those outside: shock from West and Gordon, isolated terror from Kitten, the "Goodnight, Lullaby" from Loveless and Antoinette, and emptiness from the mute, who hears nothing. (Without all the layering of reactions, Donner would copy himself on this in "The Returning Dead.") And no one has mentioned "the magic mirror" in Acts III and IV, where Loveless and Kitten see the selves they wished and believed they were. That was so creative and well-done that no one ever copied it again.

* Voigtlander's lighting, espceially the night scenes in the stable, were extraordinary. Fresh music for this episode was not composed, but (1) good use was made of weird cues from "The Burning Diamond" and "The Puppeteer," and (2) Morton Stevens created some superb new cues, humorous and dramatic, based on Bob Drasnin's work in "The Wizard Shook the Earth." (For good exaamples, listen to the music in Act III, behind Loveless's addresses his giant self in the mirror, and the final freeze/fade-out on the rippling lake.)

. Unquestionably, one of West's finest hours, jockeying with another episode to come as #1 among my personal favorites.
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JimPhelps
SS 1st assignment - desk job

USA
417 Posts

Posted - 05/11/2004 :  05:12:15  Show Profile
I apologize one again for my absence but I am now on a more flexible schedule and will have time to contribute. Thanks for your patience.

Mr. Phelps
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JimPhelps
SS 1st assignment - desk job

USA
417 Posts

Posted - 05/11/2004 :  05:15:03  Show Profile
TNOT Murderous Spring
15 April 1966

“Sorry. For a moment Artie, it was almost like I hated you.”
Jim, under Loveless drug


A fan favorite and with good reason, excellent performances, well defined characters, great direction and a clever story combining illusion and reality in a way that was relatively unknown to television at the time . In today’s world after almost two solid decades of sci-fi television we’re used to seeing the main characters “die” or suffer from incredible delusions on an almost weekly basis (The X-Files, all of the Star Trek incarnations et cetera), things were different in 1966 and (similar to TNOT Burning Diamond) even though this type of story has been made over and over again (one starring character killing another) by various shows this one remains one of my favorites not only because of the fact that it is the original but it still maintains it’s fresh and simple energy.

Most agree that this is Loveless at his most evil, with a plan to kill everybody except for who he sees fit, he no longer even mentions protecting children as a rationale for his actions, now even children will die from his chemical madness. Many of the episode's strengths lie in its subtleties; Loveless is particularly evil here in the way he exploits Kitten. We see this from the outset as Loveless registers annoyance at Kitten’s singing behind her back, and snaps at her for eating all of the chocolates at the same time he pretends to be an ally and has her do such tasks as drugging Jim’s shaving water. As she says in her monologue to Jim and Artie, Loveless “knows” what it’s like to be an outsider, he knows that Kitten has been given outsider status because of her physical form, just like Loveless himself. Yet instead of using this opportunity to reach out to someone like him, someone who really would understand, he cynically uses her while romancing the “perfect” Antoinette who may be beautiful on the outside but is really an ugly evil person. Jenie Jackson is the only other guest star with her excellent sensitive portrayal of Kitten. Under her giddy laughter the face betrays the loneliness her character describes towards the end

The plot itself concerning Jim under the influence of the mind altering drug is perfectly handled. Obvious hallucinations such as Loveless on the window ledge contrasted with “Artie’s” appearance on the stagecoach accompanied by the eerie music from TNOT Puppeteer There are subtle hints that this may not be the real Artie Jim is talking to. Ross underplays nicely as “Artie” contributing to Jim’s angst. Somewhat puzzled looks from people around him and of course Loveless’ delighted response that everything is going according to plan. It’s nicely underplayed and I didn’t really spot any cheats, the only minor nitpick I could find was a scene where Jim and “Artie” are in his room, when they leave it is “Artie” who closes the door. Since “Artie” is only a delusion he should not be able to close the door. As I said a very minor nitpick and it can always be argued that since this is a part of Jim’s hallucination anything can happen, Loveless’ drug is also quite powerful. Artie’s death is poignant, and shows us just how far we’ve come in a season. This is not the same Jim West from “TNOT Deadly Bed.” When Ross delivers the line “Why?” it’s enough to make me misty

For once the actual “nuts-and-bolts” of Loveless’ (or any mad scientist) grand scheme is logical and plausible, for the era, when most communities, even large cities depended on water directly from a lake or pond. The ponds and lakes of course are shared with the waterfowl. Loveless also crosses over into true big time villainy when he kills his hospital staff. Once again the producers ad directors decided to go with a “less is more” approach and they give us only the insane screams and sounds of bedlam from the dining room, while a guard (Mr. Falk our Jim’s own dad) stands at the door trying to keep it shut. All of this under the tones of “Lullaby and goodnight”, very creepy, and it works every time I’ve seen it. No doubt this move made Dr. Loveless quite unpopular with the henchman’s union.

Things look pretty bleak at the end of the third Act but the guys decide to use a low-tech approach against Loveless and cleverly use a well aimed turkey bone to escape (Dr Freud would have had a field day knowing that it’s RC’s real dad as the guard). The ending on the lake is tragic for the Kitten character who nobly sacrifices her life in vain and at that moment realizes what she has known all along but was not able to admit to herself; that Loveless is not in love with her.

Commercial break art: is mostly a series of close-ups but good ones, Loveless enjoying his chocolate, Jim passed out, Artie voraciously biting into that turkey leg, and the lake where Loveless was supposedly “lost”.


Mr. Phelps
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JimPhelps
SS 1st assignment - desk job

USA
417 Posts

Posted - 05/11/2004 :  05:22:39  Show Profile
Oops sorry, forgot my rating for above...

So, double plus good all the way around for all! This one gets four prosthetic noses out of four hands down. I’m off to work on “TNOT Sudden Plague”

Mr. Phelps
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